New member hello/ D8B arriving

[Y-my-R]

I just tried adding the "format:on" (no quotes, definitely no space as David said) line to the tools.ini file inside the System folder on the first D8B installation floppy via that Win98 computer, to see if it fails to start up this way (as you had mentioned earlier, had happened after adding that line).

The result for me, was the same as when trying to start without the format:on line added. Mackie OS Loader... loading... and that blinking asterisk, later.

Does it boot from the floppy to this point with the format:on line added? You said something about a corrupt floppy... or was that the reason, and it did boot to this point with format:on added?

Unfortunately, I can't try this beyond this point, because the Win98-D8B computer no longer has the big BFC cable attached internally (and all the D8B power supply components removed, and the PC power supply replaced with a standard one).
...and my actual "in service" D8B doesn't have a floppy drive (I put a silent Noctua fan behind that opening, to help push out hot air... and all my fans have an external control to regulate their speed, so I can drop them to a point where I hardly hear them... that's why that extra fan in the floppy opening is needed, IMO).

I'm thinking that editing the floppy from a Mac might just not work right, but am not sure. Maybe you know someone with a PC with a floppy drive, where you could make that quick edit?

I'm pretty sure, that you would get a "format harddrive - all data will be lost" prompt "somewhere" when booting from the first floppy (I would have thought it's on a connected VGA monitor, but it could also be on the D8B's built-in display). It doesn't just format the drive without interaction, I think... if I'd think that, I wouldn't have risked my Win98 system disk to be formatted just now, haha

...but yeah, if the floppy route doesn't work out for you, the IDE-to-CF route, and writing arjepsen's disc image to the drive should work.

Again, best of luck with all of that!

[Nick Birkby]

Thank you for the replies.

I tried OS Version 3 as well with the code altered to include format:on
The discs appear to load fine and the OS loads on prompt, but it is not formatting the drive so i get the boot error..

According some other reading, small hard drives under 550megs do not format with that command. The drive I have doesnt say the size on it, so thats a remote possibility.

Im also going to take the apple command squares out of the boot INI code and see if that perhaps changes something in how it loads. .

Theres supposed to be a format warning of some kind which Im not getting.. I think I will tinker around a bit more until the CF reader arrives, which is in a few weeks.
Thanks again for all the input and encouragement. I will update as I go.

[doktor1360]

Thank you for the replies.

I tried OS Version 3 as well with the code altered to include format:on
The discs appear to load fine and the OS loads on prompt, but it is not formatting the drive so i get the boot error..

According some other reading, small hard drives under 550megs do not format with that command. The drive I have doesnt say the size on it, so thats a remote possibility.

Im also going to take the apple command squares out of the boot INI code and see if that perhaps changes something in how it loads. .

Theres supposed to be a format warning of some kind which Im not getting.. I think I will tinker around a bit more until the CF reader arrives, which is in a few weeks.
Thanks again for all the input and encouragement. I will update as I go.

Jumping in late here (as usual) and playing a little "catch up" Those platform specific characters in the Mac file are MacOS-only control characters - my guess some sort of ASCII character with no value for the Mackie installer (Windows) parse and execute.

You may wanna familiarize yourself with the definition of an INI type file. They're essentially plain text files, serving as "property bags or lists" if you will - a configuration file... one line per instruction followed by a carriage return, with the exception being the last line - although if you enter a carriage return (new line) after the last instruction, it'll probably still work. The instructions are expected to be formatted as follows :

property:value

Don't leave ANY unwanted characters or spaces, or other stray garbage in the file or the interpreter WILL attempt to read and execute the command (throwing an unhandled error). This will most likely get you past any installation issues...

I'm not a big fan of hard disks with these desks, most of the D8B platform hardware is old tech (some of it can be updated). It's like installing drum brakes on a performance auto... these drives are ancient, noisy and emit heat, and not all that easy to locate anymore... all points being mitigated with an installation to a compact flash card (only 4 GB required). Even better when you have an IDE adapter that installs on the CPU backplane - you'll rarely (if ever) have to reopen the CPU case again...

This is all just experienced 'opinion' of mine, with the exception of the INI file definition blurb.

Have at it, Nick... and just keep reporting back any issues that require mitigation. The people that contribute to this forum will definitely help you successfully move things forward!

This all being said, you knew this had to be coming too, so here it is :
[Standard Mgmt Disclaimer] - "Your actual mileage may vary..."

[Nick Birkby]

Hello all and thanks Doktor for the advice.

Just to follow up after a week or so of silence: Ive made pretty good progress so far. The CF adapter arrived and I have made a clone drive. This boots to 5.1, though I think I need to change some settings as its not immediate. ( I have to press F1) It then boots fine until...

The long and short of it is I get to the DSP control card not ready error on both the commputer screen and the display of the mixer. The mouse does not work at this juncture. I cant get further than this at the moment.

Ive taken out all but one of the MFX cards and swapped them around and cleaned the connectors. Thee UFX vard is out.

There are a variety of things I must do:
1. Possibly use a 4gb CF card, mine is a 1Gb and very old and slow. (The original disc image was taken from a 4Gb)
2. Check the Bios settings again
3. Check the jumper on the CF adapter ( any advice here?)
4. Do a big clean on the db25plugs and cable

Anyway its much closer than I was a few weeks ago. I would recommend anyone reading this in the future to go straight to the CF card option. The floppy route might work for some but the CF seems much easier so far(at least to me..)

[Y-my-R]

That error usually happens, when the D8B console and rack unit can't communicate with each other.

...and most (or all) of that communication, happens via the DB25 cable, that is connected between the two.

So, most likely, something's "wrong" with that cable, or it's the wrong kind of cable.

The cable needs to be connected 1:1 from each pin to the other side (if you have a multimeter, you can measure both ends, to see if it is). Not all old "serial/parallel" cables like that were connected on all pins, so a "regular" old such computer cable may or may not work.

What will NOT work, is to use a DB25 cable that was intended for analog or digital audio, such as AES/EBU or TDIF cables, or any other "specialty pin-out" versions of DB25 cables - there are several.

So, my guess is that whatever DB25 cable you're currently using between the rack unit and the console, might be responsible for the problem.

Also, internally, inside the rack unit, the DB25 connector goes to the two serial port connectors on the mainboard. I once got a used D8B that had them hooked up wrong (missed a pin, when connecting one of them). So, if you're certain it's a regular 1:1 pinout cable, I'd check inside the rack unit if a previous owner messed with that.

[Nick Birkby]

Hi Y-m-R,
Yes I think I read that post. I must check that. The cable is a nondescript one that I had at hand. Ithink definitely computer and not audio/ digital audio.

Im alos going to clean the DB25 connector on the back of the mixer as that was where all the gunk was. I must get a set of pipe cleaners or something and go over each pin hole.

I have a multimter so will check pins.

I will report back soon. Thanks

[doktor1360]

Hi Y-m-R,
Yes I think I read that post. I must check that. The cable is a nondescript one that I had at hand. Ithink definitely computer and not audio/ digital audio.

Im alos going to clean the DB25 connector on the back of the mixer as that was where all the gunk was. I must get a set of pipe cleaners or something and go over each pin hole.

I have a multimter so will check pins.

I will report back soon. Thanks

Clean the ends of the DB25 connector with DeOxit (or similar electronics cleaner), Nick. The odds are good that all you'll do with pipe cleaners is push that gunky sh*t down further into the connector and/or just compact it. The cleaner will dissolve all that and remove it, and you won't harm anything electronically in the process...

As far as the cable goes, Y-my-R is all over that issue with his reply/suggestion. IF ultimately the cable is janky or the incorrect type, it's a simple replacement - they're also plentiful and available...

Ya knew it was coming...
[Standard Mgmt Disclaimer] - "Your actual mileage may vary..."

[Nick Birkby]

Hi all, just a quick follow up and some small but encouraging progress.

I used a lot of contact cleaner spray ( I cant get DeOxit readily here in South Africa but am sure its much the same)

I also sprayed and reseated some of the internal jumper cables in the mixer running from the db25 input, about 5 or 6 of them.

So now at least the desk is recognizing the cards in the slots - before it just said empty...

I reloaded all the three cards A: MFX B UFX C: MFX and they come up on the mixer lcd screen display on startup.

However it defaults to the "dsp control card not ready" error. Im starting to think it is maybe a software related issue.
I get a startup error of " A Drive error press F! to continue. Im not sure what that is about, possibly the floppy drive now unplugged as am using its power supply for the CF?
Once I press F1 it all boots fairly quickly though...

Ive read on the forum someone saying that if the CF doesnt boot right from the get-go that it fails to load the codes for the cards. Or something to that effect.

This week Im going to keep tinkering and maybe get another CF card as mentioned previously. Am very happy that the unit at least recognizes the cards...

[csp]

Nick,

Just a quick question.

I am sure that the standard setting on booting, the desk looks for the floppy drive first, so if there is no floppy drive it could cause a problem.

If you are now using the CF card rather than the hard drive, why are you using the power cable for the floppy rather than the power cable going to the hard drive as it no longer requires any power ?

I realise that you will need to buy either the floppy drive power plug or an adaptor cable to go from the large hard drive plug to the much smaller floppy drive plug size to fit the CF adaptor unit. In my case I simply purchased a short ectension cable for the hard drive and cut off the plug and soldered on a small floppy drive plug, just making sure that you get the cables soldered to the correct pins (I copied the colour and pinning that is on the floppy drive cable when doing the soldering).

Sorry but I have forgotten what the plugs are called (could be Molex but not sure !!!).

David

[doktor1360]

I am sure that the standard setting on booting, the desk looks for the floppy drive first, so if there is no floppy drive it could cause a problem.

No, it will not cause a problem under normal boot operations. The BIOS is simply looking for proper disk media on the IDE-0 chain that's correctly formatted and marked as bootable (boot flag) - the firmware then 'hands off' the operational control over to the media (HDD, CF, USB, whatever) for execution (OS loading). It's really that simple...

If you are now using the CF card rather than the hard drive, why are you using the power cable for the floppy rather than the power cable going to the hard drive as it no longer requires any power ?

Probably because any IDE->CF adapter is going to use the smaller 4-pin connector for it's +5V supply. These adapters are standard, and can be sourced all over... any good cable supplier is gonna have these on hand for sale - it's a very inexpensive industry standard adapter. Hell, I have about 4-5 laying around here somewhere (LOL)...

[Standard Amazon search]
https://www.amazon.com/floppy-drive-power-cable/s?k=floppy+drive+power+cable

If the card adapter is the type that is placed on the backplane of the CPU, a cable adapter such as above is probably gonna be required - if it's the type that's installed in the internal drive bay, you could probably get away with using the 2nd adapter on the OEM cable...

Sorry but I have forgotten what the plugs are called (could be Molex but not sure !!!).

For the Win... yes, it's a Molex type connector...

[Standard Mgmt Disclaimer] - "Your actual mileage may vary..."